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Wed May 18 14:27:43  #31


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

GalaxianExplosion wrote:

Oh, Time, I think I remember seeing that thread and being so confused about how it was planned xD. I could barely tell it was supposed to be a fight

 
Well as far as I remember, I don't think it wad actually planned. It's just a ton of deities showed up to beat up shatter

Do you remember it @specter?

Last edited by Time (Wed May 18 14:28:01)


Time.
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Wed May 18 15:46:50  #32


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Got some juicy lorebuilding for y’all.

~

In the Arena, dimesional travel is completely disabled. Deities can only enter via Ihmeidrek’s Piece. Eterna is exempt. Once deities leave, they cannot return without the help of Ihmedrek’s Piece. 

At the beginning of the plot, Nox is in possession of Ihmeidrek’s Piece. She is hiding out within the bounds of The Arena, and using the Piece to summon deities to the domain. Ihmeidrek proposed the creation of the Piece to collect the magic/matter of perished deities. This is what gives The Arena such strong magic, and what protects it from intruders/nullifies Dimensional travel. It also prevents The Arena from destabilising. 

Though deities cannot ‘die’ in the traditional sense, in some rare cases, they can ‘destabilise’. This means their matter, everything that makes up their being, can start to drift apart, or split at the seams. This eventually means they cease to exist. There are a few factors that can accumulate and cause this, but it is unknown how or why this happens.

~

Notes:

Ihmeidrek’s Piece

Artifact that contains and collects the accumulated power of perished deities. Plain, palm-sized pyramid. Hieroglyphs appear when active.

Sanur

A race of semi-feline humanoids endemic to the Arena. Few in number, but wield powerful, ancient magic.

Unnamed Sanur

Demigoddess of storms, current Priestess of Eterna. Female. Quadrupedal.

Ihmeidrek

First Priestess of Eterna. Male. Bipedal. Creator of Ihmeidrek’s Piece.

The Arena

Setting. Eterna’s Domain.
 

Last edited by Effervescence (Wed May 18 15:47:04)


Ephemeris
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Wed May 18 16:12:02  #33


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Also another note before I go- if Ihmeidrek’s Piece were removed from The Arena, Deities would be able to enter/leave as normal.

Late but thanks Specter. Have a nice day/night y’all.


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Wed May 18 17:17:27  #34


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Ah that was some quite tasty lorebuilding. I'm down for it! Really cool stuff!

Have a nice night to you as well!

The lore behind this conflict is forming nicely. I'm  looking forward to it!


Time.
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Wed May 18 17:44:14  #35


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Galaxian brought up Ark’s potential involvement in this plot, then it was said that the thing keeping the gods there can be picked up, the CDs might have motivation to get it, and now I’m getting an idea here

possibly spoilers for the cd plot if I type it out though

Last edited by ThreePunchAxel (Wed May 18 17:44:40)


           Axel
"HahAhAhaHa"
"Now I'm a little motivated"
hehe fire go fwoosh
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"Can you collect a bounty on a man who doesn't die?"
 
 

Wed May 18 18:50:25  #36


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

I feel really bad because all of this implies that Galaxian would be the best one to go out of anyone, because he could die and no one would get anything from it materially speaking lol imagine former angst being so situationally funny

Okay, so it's a trap.
I'm guessing you're getting to why the Piece is an incentive? 'Cause from what I'm getting, there's nothing stopping the deities from exploring what the situation might be from the outside, even if there are people trying to prevent them from do so (in fact, "especially" might be the better word. Sus). As has remained consistent, the general incentive in going in is lesser in comparison to the risks of getting it. 

And Axel, do you know the code for spoiler tagging it? Do the starting spoiler in brackets, and then the same for the second, except with a slash in front of "spoiler" (/). That is:

[spoiler]This would be the spoiler code[/spoiler]

-Galaxian-


Life is not beautiful;
There is no such thing as a beauteous life.
Being unable to breathe smoothly
Is proof of being alive.
 

Thu May 19 11:20:16  #37


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

spoilers ahead

the idea i had was this. The gods/and or whoever else they're taking with them go into this arena to obtain the relic. plot ensues, battle ensues, yadda yadda ensues, but after all of it, ark gets his hands on the relic. the gods think this is awesome. however, oganesson(assuming he is there) or someone who knows it, uses a code to make ark go into his living weapon mode, and ark hands over the relic to the CDs while under their control

that's the idea

Last edited by ThreePunchAxel (Thu May 19 11:31:09)


           Axel
"HahAhAhaHa"
"Now I'm a little motivated"
hehe fire go fwoosh
"Martial arts is... a way to move all cool like?"
"Can you collect a bounty on a man who doesn't die?"
 
 

Thu May 19 14:25:49  #38


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Thanks Time!

Galaxian- The incentive is the power of the relic. Think magical superbattery. There’s a huge amount of power that either party could tap into, and although it’s not the easiest to use, the rewards would be huge once they work out how to use it. It’s also highly unlikely deities outside the realm would know about it, and they would have no way of influencing events or attaining the relic from outside The Arena. Also, it’s an incredibly bad idea to just let Nox mess around with it unregulated.

Axel- As much as I like your thinking, there are several reasons why I don’t think that’d work. Firstly, I have a rough idea of how I’d like the plot to progress, and that potentially involves the artifact getting shattered or lost at some point in the aftermath of a battle, and each party competing to find as much of the artifact as possible before the other, possibly with skirmishes here and there. Secondly, I feel that is very straightforward and wouldn’t make for a particularly long or interesting plot, no offense. Lastly the CDs already have quite a significant advantage already, and getting their hands on both the relic and Ark (who as I understand it is a pretty powerful deity) would mean they would simply wipe out the uncorrupted deities with little to no resistance.


Ephemeris
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Thu May 19 17:41:33  #39


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Gotcha. Still super excited for this


           Axel
"HahAhAhaHa"
"Now I'm a little motivated"
hehe fire go fwoosh
"Martial arts is... a way to move all cool like?"
"Can you collect a bounty on a man who doesn't die?"
 
 

Thu May 19 18:04:59  #40


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

@Axel - Thanks for putting out your idea. I do agree with Ephemeris that the plot point is best left for later. In terms of "lore," Galaxian is actually not stupid enough to not make sure their allies stay on their side. I reckon before letting the other deities go, he pretty much binds them to their cause for the time being (which could also fill in the hole for why Ark's betrayal of sorts happens later rather than now; my small deity specializes in causing small inconveniences). 
I guess what I envision is something like the following. I'm just throwing out things, so there might be big flaws, and this is probably a little stereotypical to begin with. But essentially, when this plot ends, the situation might look like this:
The uncorrupted deities who entered have scored a small victory, even if only at the moment. They've unlocked the dimension and so rescued the remaining deities who were trapped inside. They've gotten close to half of the artifact shards (maybe more, maybe less, but not a marginal amount). And they're able to escape before the CDs pwn them. (I dunno how Nox is at this point; maybe she's more friendly to them, or maybe they're outright enemies now, but the gist is that Eternal's probably freed now as well, and likely has to leave her domain. That would make it so that even if Eternal has regained some control over her own domain, it's one of the first to be taken for the CDs, or something like that.) The deities decide that Time is likely the best deity as of this point to take custody of at least the majority of the shards--he has many powerful mages in his domain, and unlike deities like Ark and Galaxian, he isn't working purely by himself, which makes him the best one to protect what they've gotten so far. (I imagine that this turns out to be a good decision overall.) 
Meanwhile, greater components of the CD plot are working out outside of the dimension. Galaxian has probably spent a lot of time by himself, but he might team up with Kae at some point near this plot's end to reach a certain objective (sorry, I kinda forgot what the objective was, lol, I'm not being vague on purpose). Of course, that's not to say he's been doing nothing this entire time--I did stress the deities need to defend the mainland still--but he hasn't shown himself so out in the open before. So, this might be an opportunity the CDs take to try to get him out of the picture. Yay for Galaxi showing how he actually isn't that good at fighting. :') 
At this point, the CDs' most important priorities remain trying to take out the deities while they're more separated as well as regaining the fragments that they weren't able to get yet. This is why they decide to target Time's domain, further emboldened by Chronos' weakness from her coma. This situation seems to combine their objectives, after all. However, how plot plays at this point is more vague to me (sorry, I didn't exactly memorize potential plot points, lol), but Ark is likely to turn at this point, as he's not accounted for in the future whereabouts of the other uncorrupted deities, and that likely comes into play somehow at this moment.

That being said, this entire time, the deities are trying to band together again. It was established that by the end, Galaxian does get to join up with Time and the others, but by that point, the battle for the Clocktower is basically lost. Time abandons his domain along with the Clocktower mages, and the CDs gain a temporary victory. And the rest is up would obviously be up for us to define.
To specify, I don't think Ark and Time have split up since they left the dimension, since that would be a really bad thing to happen in my opinion. It'd also mean that if Ark turns during the battle, that might be a big reason for why the Clocktower is overrun, in addition to the CDs' numbers. But I don't know. Generally, I'm trying to keep characters important in a logical sense, but I'm not sure how well I'm doing in that regard. For instance, Galaxian should at least have done some things to make sure the deities' ability to fight back didn't crumble, even if he's also the reason why Ark is able to turn against the others once he leaves the dimension (as Galaxian would have needed to renew what he placed on the other deities once they returned, but they remain separate until the end of the Clocktower battle and so isn't able to do so). I'd like to maintain this sort of balance for other characters as well.
Moving on~

----

@Ephemeris - Here's the problem that I have regarding the artifact.
From what I've observed of GGaD, the "amount of magic" anyone has has never been a deciding factor for any immortal faction. Many deities are gods of magic, and I've taken this to mean that generally speaking, their existences already generate a surplus of power they can use. This, coupled with the risks involved in getting the artifact out, means that it might not be worth it. The artifact is, of course, important, but can it really compare with the magic already present in the mainland?
A main point from my perspective is that, going from what the CD plot has planned out so far, it's been more obvious to me that the ultimate outcome is decided by numbers rather than pure power. I think the situation Time listed--the "fight" with Shatter--demonstrated this nicely. Of course, Shatter might be one of the least combat-oriented CDs out of the group (compared to Oblivion and maybe Senshei too, for instance), I'm not sure, but you can see how in that fight, numbers won. I'm guessing most of the deities in that thread weren't ones with all that powerful domains, but they still banded together to outdo what Shatter could do. And even for where the current plot may progress, you can see how important numbers are when deities fight against deities. In the Mortem Doors plot, Oganesson plots to raise an undead army (more Xenon's words than mine) to overwhelm the deities; even if those undead can't necessarily kill those deities directly, they can still expose enough of a weakness for the uncorrupted deities to lose control of the situation. In addition to that, the CDs attack a variety of deity domains, in one major battle overwhelming even the Clocktower with those numbers. So, in this plot's premise, this sort of priority doesn't make sense (for me) in terms of how worthwhile it is to pursue it. Yes, the deities could be aiming to get the trapped deities out of there, in addition to getting the Piece, but is it really worth it? If so many deities have vanished, then surely this would have been an earlier priority, instead of being focused upon at such a crucial point in time. Maybe it's because some factors haven't been worked out yet, or maybe I have fundamental misunderstandings that others involved more in the CD plots (Time, Specter, Xenon) can correct me on. But I remain perplexed on what exactly would make this prioritization logical, considering all the circumstances that have led up until now.

I suppose what I mean is, considering how likely the situation is to be a devastating trap, why would it make sense for the deities to go into the dimension? If there isn't enough incentive, then the deities might find it wiser to ignore the situation and focus instead on priorities, such as recruiting newly created deities (although those would likely not be forumer-controlled), increasing their current defenses, or even finding better sources to enhance their own powers outside of the dimension. By ignoring the situation, at worst, the CDs would get a power boost. Substantial, sure. But is it worse than them taking control of the Mortem Doors? After all, if the deities go in and lose control of the situation, some of them might be captured, killed, or even corrupted, the "mainland" loses a huge bulk of its current defense capability, and most of all, they might not even be able to win. It doesn't seem like something anyone would think would be worth it, even for someone like Galaxian, who retains unrealistic morals and outlooks at times. 
Speaking for myself, I think that tactically, no matter how much the Piece might mean in terms of magic, the overall situation just makes getting it unwise, even calculating in the deities who might have already entered the dimension. As an analogy, I think of getting the Piece as being equivalent to gaining a city in warfare. In this scenario, that city is important--but to get it, the army has to use valuable resources and take huge risks, potentially losing many other key cities and destroying itself in the process. In this case, it would be better to grit one's teeth and take the loss of that single city, rather than lose all the other ones and completely ruin the cause.
Overall, it seems that no single object has ever decreed the difference between victory and defeat for the deities. So, it seems somewhat preposterous for me to imagine that this case is much different.

-Galaxian-


Life is not beautiful;
There is no such thing as a beauteous life.
Being unable to breathe smoothly
Is proof of being alive.
 

Fri May 20 10:50:09  #41


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Galaxian- Thanks for the detailed analysis, as not only does this better fill me in on a lot of the plot I missed, but also allows me to work the weakest aspects of the concept.

I think part of the ultility of the Piece is not just the fact it contains a huge amount of raw power, but that the power is completely ‘blank’ and not restricted to any particular aspect like most deities’ magic The Piece is this enormous well of blank, impressionable matter that could be shaped into anything and/or used in any way.

Although I know there are deities of magic already who don’t have these limitations, the thing to think is that whereas that is the power of a single deity, the Piece contanins that of many, possibly hundreds, of long-gone deities. For example, a deity of magic could be severely limited by someone with nullification abilities (such as Nox), and would not have much influence in the sphere of space for example, and would be limited by what spells they know/can cast and their effects. The Piece’s matter/magic would not be limited by this.

I don’t want to speculate on exactly how it could be used to prevent the Mortem Doors from being opened, because they are Xenon’s and frankly I don’t know the ins and outs of how they work etc. But, for example, the Piece could be used to seal/limit the powers of a CD or Deity. Or prevent travel from other realms (see: realm of the dead) in the way it does for The Arena. Potentially, it could even be used to create an army of the deities/CDs own.

I’m really struggling to put what I have in my mind to ‘paper’ (hopefully you know what I mean), and this might not change the situation particularly much, but I hoped it has clarified the situation somewhat.

If it hasn’t helped another function will have to be discussed that would make it worthwhile for the deities to contest.

Last edited by Effervescence (Fri May 20 10:50:37)


Ephemeris
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Fri May 20 12:10:54  #42


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

I think I'm talking too much xD, I would rather the others who participated in the plot and others before it to let us know what they think, because I'm sure I'm seeming like I'm unwilling to accept change and am generally being too stubborn. (Which are valid perceptions. xD)
"I might be talking too much," I say, and then proceed to continue~
But my primary consideration still remains that there is lore that we should adhere to, or else we risk making past plots seem uncredible. That lore is specifically related to deity domains. Why would this piece be existent when so many generations of deities have relied on their own domains, rather than having any connection to those of their predecessors'? (That implies past deities' domains are not kept. In this case, it feels like the past deities should be able to transfer more than just their deityship.) Or if this isn't exactly the norm but can be done, why hasn't logrolling past deities' powers and abilities (into a single form or otherwise) already been done in another form? I'm kinda blanking on how to phrase these questions better (lol what is conciseness), but those are two questions that I can think of in the moment.
I'm generally just super concerned that adding this sort of update to the lore might be a bit nonsensical or too significant. Kinda like the Star Wars sequel trilogy adding in "Force healing." It's technically not that significant generally speaking (that being said, I haven't watched the movies, lol, they ain't getting my money 'cause I don't have any), but then you look at important plot points in the original and prequel trilogies, and it only gets worse from there.

-Galaxian-


Life is not beautiful;
There is no such thing as a beauteous life.
Being unable to breathe smoothly
Is proof of being alive.
 

Fri May 20 13:03:44  #43


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Yes, I think it’s definitely best to wait for some more input from other parties.

That said, I don’t think it irrelevises (is that a word?) past plots. It doesn’t really affect a deity’s domain (as in, realm, house, residence whatever) as that would still be there unless it was dependent on their power or something. Also, for Eterna, the connection to predecessors does tie-in somewhat loosely with one of her spheres (souls) but it was initially created by Ihmeidrek (using her power, admittedly). It hasn’t been done, I suppose, because no one thought to try, or didn’t have the means to create such an effect.

Oh and as a side note, Force healing was the least of the sequel’s problems, whole thing was a shambles resulting from Disney trying to uncreatively milk more money from the Star Wars cash cow. I can see the comparison you’re making, though. 

Could others share their thoughts on this issue please?


Ephemeris
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Fri May 20 14:50:44  #44


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Oh the reason I wasn't speaking was because I thought all the walls of text might scare people away. If I were to add a wall of my own it'll also scare more people lol. But anyways, here's my thoughts

Let me try to see if I'm interpreting your words correctly Galaxian. I'm probably not, but anyways,

For now, I don't really see how it would fully affect past plots. As Ephemeris said, the location is completely separate.

For the second question, I'm assuming that simply it just couldn't be done under special situations. That's about all. It can just be really rare. Idk.


Time.
I love my pfp (its no longer new)
 

Fri May 20 20:02:41  #45


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Sorry sorry, I was about to go out when I realized others don't use "domain" interchangeably with "governance" (in terms of what deities are deities of), my bad fjsdifoikdjfos. 

And sorry again for not addressing your posts individually, but I did want to get an idea down. That being said, I formulated it while I was counting to 40 for like the 40th time, and by that point my sanity was definitely questionable.
Anyway, I kinda thought of a way to make it so that the Piece is still powerful but isn't necessarily connected to uncorrupted deities. Rather, what if it is related to the process as a deity corrupts?
I understand that as a community, we all (presumably) have different interpretations on what makes a deity corrupt, but for this idea, I'm basing it off the thought that the process isn't just a deity separating into two parts after trauma and it just...being that. Done and over with. After all, the new corrupted deity has a whole new set of domains (again, using it as "governance" here) and is basically a whole new entity (iirc, most CDs don't see their own identity as being connected to their "sources"). I think it would make sense if a deity actually loses some power ("parts of themselves") when they corrupt as part of the larger process (though maybe this only happens if the two forms, the corrupted and uncorrupted, separate from each other? For deities who are completely corrupted, I think they'd lose even more). So, this plot could very well be an exploration of a situation that only the deities would really care about--but at the same time, they can't really go into it for the most part due to its relations to corruption. Maybe this topic being unexplored is due to how dangerous it to explore it--for instance, even deities who have corrupted before wouldn't be able to find this phenomenon without corrupting (to some extent) again, so it is the CDs taking the initiative on the matter that alerts them in this case, making it so that they follow their enemies into this trap or whatever.
I'm not really sure on how this connects exactly, because I want to keep it open (as open as I can leave it at least, lol, I impose my ideas on everything, and I do apologize for that), but maybe the Piece relates to the things lost by deities during corruption. For some deities, it might have been their entire existence; others would have lost less drastic things (like what they could govern over, parts of their powers, etc. Maybe even personality shifts from corruption could be represented somehow). But I think that, overall, it would make sense for this sort of thing to conglomerate a lot of power, because it would then effectively store what deities over time lost at their worst moments. And maybe, at this point, the deities have realized how important it is to really look into the process before more of them are pulled into the Corrupted Deities' ranks. Or something.
I couldn't find a way to incorporate this in the above section, but I wanted to list some connections to concepts we have gone over/wanted to include. First, this is apparently a special situation. If what's going on with Eternal's domain has really never been done before, I don't think it wouldn't have been done because no one thought of it or could have, so this concept could potentially rationalize it being a first time. Second, Eternal's the deity of souls. I'm not as familiar with most deity corruptions, but it feels like if most of the CDs were results of their counterparts enduring trauma, the corruption process likely is related to the essence of a deity--which could be represented by a soul. Again, I'm pretty sure she wouldn't be the first deity of souls (and related areas), and the current generation of CDs isn't the first one either, so this would have to be combined with other factors to culminate in what's currently happening.

And of course, we can maybe explore what happens as a deity corrupts through this plot! It's important knowledge for the uncorrupted deities heading forward, even if they gain literally nothing else in the end. I think.

Sorry, this post is so bad, lol. I have a lot of ideas running through my head, but I really don't want to be too repetitive.
Let me know how stupid this all sounds, lol. I won't be too hurt. lol

-Galaxian-


Life is not beautiful;
There is no such thing as a beauteous life.
Being unable to breathe smoothly
Is proof of being alive.
 

Sun May 22 02:28:56  #46


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Hey, that's a pretty intesting idea I think that could be developed as well!

I'd be down for something like that in addition to or in replacement of what is currently in mind for the piece. That is ofc if Eternal is also down for that.


Time.
I love my pfp (its no longer new)
 

Mon May 23 02:52:42  #47


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Yeah I think in addition would be the way to go.


Ephemeris
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Wed Jun 1 16:39:10  #48


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Hi hi, sorry for the late response. I've been trying to put together my thoughts and also have been waiting for Chan to go over the posts, but they're probably busy with something (also sorry if I used different pronouns before, I was too used to the old ones lol, and now they don't necessarily go by any pronouns), so yeah, I'll just put a message down here.
First, I want to say that if I am being too imposing on this plot, I'd like for you guys to tell me outright rather than feel bad about it. I know I can be overenthusiastic and can disregard others' feelings when I am excited, so if any of you would rather me stop contributing, I'm fine with it. Just please word the "Go away" message a little softer than how it would have otherwise been lol, I am a little sensitive. 
Second, I've still been thinking about how to word my ideas better, and still to no avail. I did think more about this happening being reasoned largely by the fact that it's Eternal's domain (and of course I say that without knowing what's happening on her end). We've already established that deities have a degree of control over their domain that no one else can usurp. But beyond that, I would still suggest more thought into why she's allowing this to happen in her domain when she has such control over it (if this thought isn't already present in the first place). Furthermore, for consistency purposes, this point should also be constructed so that future plot points make sense in the context for domain (this time I'm talking about the place lol) control.
And that's about it, really. I think that my concerns have already been voiced, even if inadequately, so there's no need for me to continue pressing my points repeatedly.
Let me know if I should go away, lol.

-Galaxian-


Life is not beautiful;
There is no such thing as a beauteous life.
Being unable to breathe smoothly
Is proof of being alive.
 

Wed Jun 1 20:00:09  #49


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

Oh, yeah, I was just chilling. I was just waiting to see if anyone would reply. But as of right now I'm still good to go. We currently have some solid planning.

Ephemeris, you still there?


Time.
I love my pfp (its no longer new)
 

Thu Jun 2 10:51:06  #50


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

ready to rock as well

just waiting for it to begin


           Axel
"HahAhAhaHa"
"Now I'm a little motivated"
hehe fire go fwoosh
"Martial arts is... a way to move all cool like?"
"Can you collect a bounty on a man who doesn't die?"
 
 

Mon Jun 13 00:45:53  #51


Re: Plot Arc/Concept

As a note for anyone who hasn't seen it on Discord yet, Ephemeris is inactive in order to take care of a sick relative, so planning will be on hiatus for the time being. However, feel free to put your own plot ideas out there for others to see if you would like, whether here or elsewhere. Thanks! 

-Galaxian-


Life is not beautiful;
There is no such thing as a beauteous life.
Being unable to breathe smoothly
Is proof of being alive.
 

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